1 00:00:05,422 --> 00:00:06,798 This series is based on Kate del Castillo's account 2 00:00:06,882 --> 00:00:08,258 of events related to her meeting with Sean Penn and "El Chapo" Guzm�n. 3 00:00:08,342 --> 00:00:09,676 The opinions expressed are those of the commentators featured. 4 00:00:13,472 --> 00:00:15,724 Sean Penn... Who is Sean Penn? 5 00:00:31,365 --> 00:00:34,910 It's incredible to be able to sit down and talk to someone like that. 6 00:00:34,993 --> 00:00:38,413 He's a Hollywood figure and he's a great actor. 7 00:00:38,497 --> 00:00:40,249 As for him being a good journalist... 8 00:00:40,332 --> 00:00:41,625 I don't know. 9 00:00:53,845 --> 00:00:55,389 But something was telling me, 10 00:00:55,472 --> 00:00:58,100 "He isn't 100% on Kate's side. 11 00:00:58,183 --> 00:00:59,726 He's thinking about himself." 12 00:00:59,810 --> 00:01:03,981 He's always been a controversial figure with a strong temperament. 13 00:01:04,064 --> 00:01:07,859 Sean Penn is with us here today. Let's give him a round of applause. 14 00:01:12,197 --> 00:01:16,201 For me, Kate's big mistake was not meeting El Chapo, 15 00:01:16,285 --> 00:01:18,120 but rather bringing Sean Penn along. 16 00:01:23,208 --> 00:01:27,421 A NETFLIX ORIGINAL SERIES 17 00:01:43,603 --> 00:01:44,980 WELCOME TO BADIRAGUATO 18 00:02:08,545 --> 00:02:11,757 THE DAY I MET EL CHAPO 19 00:02:12,633 --> 00:02:13,967 OCTOBER 1, 2015 20 00:02:14,051 --> 00:02:17,429 THE DAY BEFORE THE TRIP 21 00:02:56,176 --> 00:03:01,098 I thought it was important for Mr. Guzm�n to meet the producers and Sean. 22 00:03:01,515 --> 00:03:04,226 Because we were all going to be making the movie. 23 00:03:04,309 --> 00:03:07,771 So it was important that he get to know them and for everyone to be happy. 24 00:03:09,272 --> 00:03:13,652 Mr. Guzm�n asked me who Sean Penn was. 25 00:03:14,236 --> 00:03:16,655 I told him that he was an actor 26 00:03:16,738 --> 00:03:18,323 who had been married to Madonna, 27 00:03:19,116 --> 00:03:22,327 and who had made several movies. 28 00:03:22,744 --> 00:03:25,622 He wasn't too interested. He just wanted to know who he was. 29 00:03:25,705 --> 00:03:28,583 I did tell him clearly that he was American 30 00:03:28,667 --> 00:03:32,671 and that he honestly didn't seem like a trustworthy person. 31 00:03:33,213 --> 00:03:37,050 But he didn't really care. He wanted her to come with whoever she wanted. 32 00:03:40,887 --> 00:03:42,639 I don't know 33 00:03:42,723 --> 00:03:47,102 how on earth El Chapo Guzm�n didn't know who Sean Penn was. 34 00:03:47,519 --> 00:03:51,690 "Well, he's a Hollywood actor." "Oh. What has he done?" 35 00:03:52,190 --> 00:03:54,609 He had no idea who Sean Penn was. 36 00:03:55,527 --> 00:03:58,989 The day before we left, we were excited but also nervous. 37 00:03:59,072 --> 00:04:00,282 I don't know about him... 38 00:04:00,365 --> 00:04:04,703 He came by to bring me his passport and ended up staying for the tasting. 39 00:04:05,454 --> 00:04:07,330 Tequila and mariachi! 40 00:04:07,414 --> 00:04:10,417 KATE'S HOUSE LOS ANGELES, CA, USA 41 00:04:13,378 --> 00:04:17,382 Sean Penn is a lot of fun. He's charming, he's charismatic... 42 00:04:17,966 --> 00:04:21,595 He's an interesting guy to watch and listen to and all that. 43 00:04:21,678 --> 00:04:23,096 He's got the best anecdotes. 44 00:04:23,180 --> 00:04:25,140 His anecdotes involve Marlon Brando. 45 00:04:25,223 --> 00:04:27,851 His anecdotes are to die for. 46 00:04:27,934 --> 00:04:32,063 Anecdotes with De Niro, Pacino, and many more. You'd think, "Incredible!" 47 00:04:33,231 --> 00:04:36,234 There was a great sense of complicity between Sean and I. 48 00:04:36,318 --> 00:04:38,779 We both knew, but no one else did, 49 00:04:38,862 --> 00:04:45,202 that the next day we'd be taking one of the most important trips of our lives. 50 00:04:45,577 --> 00:04:49,414 It was something that could either change our lives or end our lives. 51 00:05:02,177 --> 00:05:03,720 OCTOBER 2, 2015 52 00:05:03,804 --> 00:05:08,016 THE DAY OF THE MEETING WITH EL CHAPO. 53 00:05:08,099 --> 00:05:11,728 HE'S HIDING SOMEWHERE IN MEXICO... 54 00:05:21,905 --> 00:05:24,199 I woke up and thought, "What am I going to wear?" 55 00:05:24,282 --> 00:05:28,119 I didn't know whether the place they were taking us would be hot or cold. 56 00:05:28,203 --> 00:05:30,872 I wanted to bring something for El Chapo. 57 00:05:30,956 --> 00:05:35,210 I brought him a bottle of my tequila as a gift 58 00:05:35,293 --> 00:05:37,963 and to thank him for his trust. 59 00:05:38,463 --> 00:05:40,882 I brought him a book by Sabines. 60 00:05:41,550 --> 00:05:44,344 Perhaps I wanted to make him more sensitive somehow. 61 00:05:45,345 --> 00:05:47,347 Before we got on the plane, 62 00:05:47,931 --> 00:05:50,392 El Chapo and I were texting. 63 00:05:52,227 --> 00:05:55,647 As soon as I boarded, I told him, "We're already on the plane. 64 00:05:56,022 --> 00:05:57,357 I'll switch off my phone." 65 00:05:57,440 --> 00:05:59,526 He told me, "I'll switch off mine as well." 66 00:05:59,859 --> 00:06:04,155 He told me, "I won't speak to you at all until I see you in person." 67 00:06:06,283 --> 00:06:10,870 At the time, El Chapo was the most wanted man by two governments. 68 00:06:10,954 --> 00:06:15,333 And we were the only people who had the chance of meeting him face to face. 69 00:06:16,835 --> 00:06:19,921 In this case, it would be a risk for Mr. Joaqu�n Guzm�n. 70 00:06:20,714 --> 00:06:23,550 It was a risk and he was warned. Of course it was a risk. 71 00:06:23,633 --> 00:06:26,553 But he wanted to take it. Mr. Guzm�n wanted to take that risk. 72 00:06:27,137 --> 00:06:29,598 He's someone who has no fears. 73 00:06:30,390 --> 00:06:32,642 So he didn't mind taking another risk. 74 00:06:35,520 --> 00:06:39,858 How can you talk directly like that to a drug dealer? 75 00:06:40,442 --> 00:06:44,529 You cannot mess around with someone like him. 76 00:06:44,613 --> 00:06:47,490 We're talking about the most wanted criminal in the world. 77 00:06:47,574 --> 00:06:50,619 El Chapo is like a saint, miss. 78 00:06:50,702 --> 00:06:55,874 They say El Chapo is around here. 79 00:06:56,499 --> 00:06:58,293 This is his area of influence. 80 00:06:58,585 --> 00:07:02,922 Who knows where he is? That is a mystery to all of us. 81 00:07:03,923 --> 00:07:06,718 When you interview a criminal on the run, 82 00:07:07,135 --> 00:07:09,679 they don't tell you anything at all. 83 00:07:10,013 --> 00:07:12,599 I mean, they don't tell you what the protocol is, 84 00:07:13,099 --> 00:07:15,310 so everything is spontaneous. 85 00:07:15,727 --> 00:07:20,398 You have to dive into a clandestine spectrum. 86 00:07:20,482 --> 00:07:22,567 And that gets the adrenaline flowing. 87 00:07:27,447 --> 00:07:30,575 I know it was dangerous, and I understood what it would entail, 88 00:07:30,659 --> 00:07:34,537 but I was really excited to set out on that journey. 89 00:07:37,499 --> 00:07:41,002 GUADALAJARA AIRPORT GUADALAJARA, MEXICO 90 00:07:41,086 --> 00:07:46,675 The Mexican government were monitoring, from the very beginning, 91 00:07:46,758 --> 00:07:51,388 Kate del Castillo, Sean Penn and El Chapo Guzm�n himself. 92 00:07:51,471 --> 00:07:55,433 They even had pictures of Kate and Sean at the airport. 93 00:07:56,935 --> 00:07:58,937 RETIRED DEA AGENT 94 00:08:02,983 --> 00:08:06,695 As soon as they pinpointed the area 95 00:08:06,778 --> 00:08:08,405 where El Chapo was thought to be, 96 00:08:08,488 --> 00:08:11,116 they found a communication link between him and her. 97 00:08:14,536 --> 00:08:17,998 They didn't have the specifics because it's a complex area, 98 00:08:18,081 --> 00:08:21,001 but they were intrigued that a person who was here in LA 99 00:08:21,418 --> 00:08:25,088 was suddenly having intermittent contact with him. 100 00:08:25,880 --> 00:08:30,927 Later on, they identified that it was about a potential meeting. 101 00:08:32,887 --> 00:08:35,348 When we got there, we went straight to the hotel. 102 00:08:35,682 --> 00:08:39,602 Mr. Guzm�n's lawyer was already waiting for us when we arrived. 103 00:08:39,686 --> 00:08:43,440 He told us to leave behind our phones and everything else we had brought. 104 00:08:43,523 --> 00:08:47,944 And so we did, except for Sean, who kept a small suitcase he had brought along. 105 00:08:49,362 --> 00:08:52,741 From what I was told, Sean Penn's bag wasn't checked 106 00:08:52,824 --> 00:08:55,076 because Mr. Guzm�n never asked. 107 00:08:55,160 --> 00:08:58,163 He simply trusted the people who were coming. 108 00:08:59,164 --> 00:09:02,250 At that point, a fancy car arrived, 109 00:09:02,751 --> 00:09:05,503 followed by two large SUVs. 110 00:09:05,587 --> 00:09:08,089 It looked like they contained security personnel. 111 00:09:09,799 --> 00:09:11,760 As soon as she arrived in Mexico, 112 00:09:11,843 --> 00:09:15,388 she managed to fool the authorities through El Chapo's people. 113 00:09:15,472 --> 00:09:19,893 They were prepared, and they were professionals in that area. 114 00:09:21,311 --> 00:09:23,688 They sent a decoy Kate in one direction, 115 00:09:23,772 --> 00:09:26,191 another one in a different direction, and so on, 116 00:09:26,274 --> 00:09:27,984 with the purpose of misleading... 117 00:09:28,818 --> 00:09:31,446 National Security, who didn't know who to follow. 118 00:09:32,697 --> 00:09:35,575 And then she completely vanished. 119 00:09:41,539 --> 00:09:45,960 Even as journalists, we do not pursue any close encounters with the narcos. 120 00:09:46,044 --> 00:09:51,633 Neither do we like to be intermediaries or act as such, 121 00:09:51,716 --> 00:09:54,344 because we think it's a delicate and dangerous issue. 122 00:10:01,810 --> 00:10:05,855 At that moment, she could have been detained at any point, and she knew it. 123 00:10:10,026 --> 00:10:14,072 We got to a place that was fenced off. 124 00:10:15,698 --> 00:10:19,160 And we went into a clandestine landing strip, 125 00:10:19,244 --> 00:10:22,080 where two Cessna aircraft were waiting. 126 00:10:22,622 --> 00:10:25,542 I said, "Oh my God. Where are we going?" 127 00:10:28,294 --> 00:10:30,088 I remember getting on the plane... 128 00:10:30,171 --> 00:10:34,300 and I was... literally shaking. 129 00:10:36,386 --> 00:10:39,681 I was very scared and had my doubts. 130 00:10:39,764 --> 00:10:42,600 I had already taken two or three sips of the tequila 131 00:10:42,684 --> 00:10:45,395 because that was the only way I could control my nerves. 132 00:10:49,440 --> 00:10:53,236 During the trip, I thought, "Who knows where this man will take us?" 133 00:10:53,319 --> 00:10:54,529 We didn't know who he was. 134 00:10:54,612 --> 00:10:59,075 He started saying, "My dad this, and my dad, that..." 135 00:10:59,159 --> 00:11:00,785 And I asked him, "Who is your dad?" 136 00:11:00,869 --> 00:11:02,996 He said, "What do you mean? You don't know? 137 00:11:03,079 --> 00:11:05,331 My dad is Joaqu�n, El Chapo." 138 00:11:05,832 --> 00:11:10,378 I said, "OK," and I turned around and told Sean, "I think this is important. 139 00:11:10,461 --> 00:11:11,796 He is El Chapo's son." 140 00:11:13,882 --> 00:11:17,010 Then I asked him, "Aren't you going to blindfold us?" 141 00:11:17,594 --> 00:11:19,888 He said, "No. Where is the trust? 142 00:11:19,971 --> 00:11:22,140 What were you told? What movie did you watch? 143 00:11:22,223 --> 00:11:26,603 No, no, no. And ultimately, do you know where you are?" 144 00:11:27,604 --> 00:11:28,605 "Well, no." 145 00:11:29,856 --> 00:11:31,024 I had no idea. 146 00:11:34,277 --> 00:11:35,486 We landed. 147 00:11:37,280 --> 00:11:39,657 They told us, "Come on! Get off, quickly!" 148 00:11:39,741 --> 00:11:43,703 We got off the aircraft, and there were vans already waiting for us. 149 00:11:44,996 --> 00:11:46,039 And we left. 150 00:11:46,915 --> 00:11:50,960 SOMEWHERE IN THE SINALOA MOUNTAINS 151 00:11:51,461 --> 00:11:54,672 I had no idea where we would meet, if it would be at his home... 152 00:11:55,381 --> 00:11:58,301 We didn't know what would happen or where we were going. 153 00:12:01,679 --> 00:12:04,891 Night had already fallen and it was completely dark. 154 00:12:06,935 --> 00:12:09,896 We finally arrived at a place... 155 00:12:13,608 --> 00:12:15,944 I got out of the car, and I couldn't see anything. 156 00:12:16,027 --> 00:12:18,154 I didn't know who had opened the door for me. 157 00:12:19,405 --> 00:12:21,741 I got out and I was greeted with a hug. 158 00:12:21,824 --> 00:12:24,577 And I heard, "My friend... Welcome." 159 00:12:25,495 --> 00:12:27,580 I got goose bumps. 160 00:12:28,206 --> 00:12:30,166 I couldn't believe it. 161 00:12:30,249 --> 00:12:33,378 I knew it was him simply because he called me "friend." 162 00:12:34,712 --> 00:12:36,923 El Chapo Guzm�n falls in love very easily. 163 00:12:37,006 --> 00:12:39,300 He loves impossible love stories. 164 00:12:40,718 --> 00:12:43,888 And this was his next romantic target, 165 00:12:43,972 --> 00:12:48,685 someone who apparently seemed impossible to seduce. 166 00:12:48,768 --> 00:12:50,770 And it turned into an obsession, 167 00:12:50,853 --> 00:12:54,148 because this was someone who was beautiful, kind and smart, 168 00:12:54,232 --> 00:12:57,819 and who had publicly defended him on Twitter. 169 00:12:58,236 --> 00:13:01,114 She had said that he raised more interesting points 170 00:13:01,197 --> 00:13:03,074 than corrupt governments. 171 00:13:04,242 --> 00:13:05,576 This was a tunnel of love, 172 00:13:05,660 --> 00:13:09,622 built to reach a woman who was apparently out of his reach. 173 00:13:11,457 --> 00:13:15,128 "Life is a business. The only thing that changes is the commodity. Right?" 174 00:13:18,339 --> 00:13:22,093 Well, gentlemen, I'm Teresa Mendoza. And I'm the Queen of the South. 175 00:13:22,176 --> 00:13:26,472 El Chapo Guzm�n and millions of Mexicans became Kate's fans 176 00:13:26,556 --> 00:13:27,890 thanks to La Reina del Sur. 177 00:13:29,308 --> 00:13:30,309 Kate! 178 00:13:30,727 --> 00:13:35,356 Thank you for placing your trust in us and granting us an interview. 179 00:13:36,024 --> 00:13:38,943 I think, because of the interview I did with her, 180 00:13:39,402 --> 00:13:41,320 it was during that hit TV series... 181 00:13:42,947 --> 00:13:48,202 that she started looking for a way to get in touch with El Chapo. 182 00:13:48,286 --> 00:13:54,125 I don't know if that was her plan, but the life of this character caught her eye. 183 00:13:54,208 --> 00:13:58,046 I think the same thing happened to El Chapo with Kate del Castillo. 184 00:13:58,129 --> 00:14:00,465 And that's why he granted her the interview. 185 00:14:01,257 --> 00:14:02,550 I need your help. 186 00:14:02,633 --> 00:14:05,720 I'm sorry to tell you, but there's nothing I can do for you. 187 00:14:05,803 --> 00:14:08,389 When he watched the TV series La Reina del Sur, 188 00:14:08,473 --> 00:14:10,725 her performance caught his eye. 189 00:14:11,392 --> 00:14:12,810 We spoke, 190 00:14:12,894 --> 00:14:15,313 and he was happy to see that a Mexican lady, 191 00:14:15,396 --> 00:14:19,567 an actress like Kate del Castillo, had those qualities 192 00:14:19,650 --> 00:14:23,613 and knew how to do a show like that. 193 00:14:26,240 --> 00:14:30,328 The second time El Chapo Guzm�n escaped, 194 00:14:30,787 --> 00:14:34,624 the TV series he had been watching for the third time was La Reina del Sur. 195 00:14:35,166 --> 00:14:38,628 So, that's kind of like a compliment, right? 196 00:14:39,253 --> 00:14:41,047 You crazy South American... 197 00:14:43,591 --> 00:14:46,636 I'm not South American! Mexico is in the North, you idiot! 198 00:14:46,719 --> 00:14:48,971 I'm a Northerner! A Northerner! 199 00:14:49,055 --> 00:14:53,601 In Colombia, the artist who played Pablo Escobar 200 00:14:53,684 --> 00:14:57,480 at one point said, "I don't know whether he's an angel or a demon." 201 00:14:58,231 --> 00:15:02,026 So, when you contaminate yourself, so to speak, 202 00:15:02,110 --> 00:15:04,362 with the world of drug dealing, 203 00:15:04,445 --> 00:15:08,533 you somehow end up understanding and justifying 204 00:15:08,616 --> 00:15:11,994 those characters and the world they live in. 205 00:15:30,847 --> 00:15:34,225 Your enemies await your order as to their fate. 206 00:15:34,308 --> 00:15:37,770 Everyone is talking about this justification of drug dealers. 207 00:15:37,854 --> 00:15:40,356 We are actors and we tell stories. 208 00:15:40,440 --> 00:15:44,110 And, yes, they are sensitive issues because of what's going on in Mexico, 209 00:15:44,193 --> 00:15:46,612 but... it's fiction! 210 00:15:46,946 --> 00:15:50,408 I don't want to be Teresa Mendoza. I don't want Teresa Mendoza's life. 211 00:15:50,491 --> 00:15:51,409 I don't want to hide. 212 00:15:51,492 --> 00:15:56,914 And if that is considered to be justifying drug dealers, well, I don't agree. 213 00:16:01,711 --> 00:16:04,714 Something about Kate that got my attention, 214 00:16:05,047 --> 00:16:09,051 was that she once said, "The word 'cut' exists!" 215 00:16:09,135 --> 00:16:11,012 Many people don't understand that. 216 00:16:11,095 --> 00:16:14,223 They are human beings who are acting, 217 00:16:14,307 --> 00:16:17,894 until they hear "cut", and then they go back to their normal lives. 218 00:16:20,563 --> 00:16:21,772 He made me sit down. 219 00:16:22,482 --> 00:16:24,066 He sat right next to me. 220 00:16:24,567 --> 00:16:29,697 To his left was Iv�n, his eldest son, whom I had met that one time. 221 00:16:30,156 --> 00:16:34,494 Alfredo sat down here, to my right. 222 00:16:35,912 --> 00:16:38,164 And there sat Jos� Ib��ez. 223 00:16:38,623 --> 00:16:40,458 Sean sat in front of me. 224 00:16:40,833 --> 00:16:42,543 Once we were all settled, 225 00:16:42,627 --> 00:16:46,339 the first thing he said to me was, "My friend, you must be hungry." 226 00:16:46,422 --> 00:16:48,758 I told him, "We're starving. We haven't eaten." 227 00:16:49,175 --> 00:16:51,802 So he brought me grilled pork tacos. 228 00:16:51,886 --> 00:16:55,139 I started eating and I couldn't even manage the first bite. 229 00:16:55,223 --> 00:17:00,978 I didn't want to reject his food because I thought it was very rude, 230 00:17:01,062 --> 00:17:03,981 but I couldn't even swallow it. 231 00:17:05,816 --> 00:17:07,401 I took out the bottle of Honor. 232 00:17:07,944 --> 00:17:11,113 After chatting and eating for a while, 233 00:17:11,197 --> 00:17:16,244 Sean told me, "Kate, please ask him if I can interview him." 234 00:17:18,538 --> 00:17:20,164 No one ever told me... 235 00:17:20,915 --> 00:17:24,877 Or Sean never told me he wanted to do an interview for a magazine. 236 00:17:24,961 --> 00:17:27,713 When you sit down in front of Mr. Guzm�n Loera, 237 00:17:27,797 --> 00:17:29,674 that is not the time to change the plan. 238 00:17:29,757 --> 00:17:31,092 "I came to discuss my movie, 239 00:17:31,175 --> 00:17:34,428 but the man I brought with me wants to talk about an article." 240 00:17:44,146 --> 00:17:46,357 KATE'S US LAWYER 241 00:17:54,031 --> 00:17:55,366 I got uncomfortable. 242 00:17:55,866 --> 00:17:58,160 So, I turned around and said... 243 00:17:59,078 --> 00:18:03,082 "My friend, Sean is asking whether he can interview you." 244 00:18:03,958 --> 00:18:06,002 And he replied, "An interview? What for?" 245 00:18:08,879 --> 00:18:11,090 And I said, "For the Rolling Stone magazine." 246 00:18:11,173 --> 00:18:14,343 He turned around and asked his sons, "Do you know that magazine?" 247 00:18:14,844 --> 00:18:17,805 And Iv�n says, "Yes, dad, I've... 248 00:18:18,556 --> 00:18:21,058 I've heard of that magazine. I know which one it is." 249 00:18:23,060 --> 00:18:25,104 Se he said, "Yes, I'll do it. 250 00:18:25,187 --> 00:18:28,024 If you think that's a good thing, my friend, I'll do it." 251 00:18:28,899 --> 00:18:30,610 I thought, "I can't believe it." 252 00:18:34,363 --> 00:18:35,990 I think it took her by surprise. 253 00:18:36,073 --> 00:18:39,702 It wasn't part of the initial project they had in mind. 254 00:18:39,785 --> 00:18:42,038 They were supposed to talk about the movie. 255 00:18:43,247 --> 00:18:45,082 Not an interview. 256 00:18:58,638 --> 00:19:00,765 No one had ever interviewed him. 257 00:19:01,682 --> 00:19:03,267 This had never happened before. 258 00:19:03,351 --> 00:19:07,647 I thought to myself, "There must be a reason for this because he is no fool." 259 00:19:08,314 --> 00:19:11,609 These thoughts were crossing my mind at a million miles per minute. 260 00:19:11,692 --> 00:19:15,613 I thought, "Maybe it's because we don't know what will happen to Mr. Guzm�n, 261 00:19:15,696 --> 00:19:21,160 so our movie can be based on that article, on the interview done by Sean." 262 00:19:22,495 --> 00:19:26,082 So I thought, "OK." I calmed myself down, and took a deep breath. 263 00:19:26,165 --> 00:19:30,461 I didn't want them to realize that I was uncomfortable. 264 00:19:30,544 --> 00:19:33,172 So I turned to Sean and told him, "He said yes." 265 00:19:33,673 --> 00:19:38,552 And he said, "OK, and do you think I can ask him the questions now? 266 00:19:38,886 --> 00:19:41,347 Or should I stay here for a couple of days?" 267 00:19:44,058 --> 00:19:50,815 "Sean asks whether he can stay with you for a couple of days to interview you." 268 00:19:50,898 --> 00:19:52,316 I already knew the answer... 269 00:19:52,942 --> 00:19:56,487 So El Chapo said, "Tell this disheveled guy that I've just met him." 270 00:19:57,780 --> 00:20:00,449 And I said, "He's just met you. 271 00:20:00,533 --> 00:20:04,995 You can't stay because he doesn't live here. He won't stay here." 272 00:20:05,079 --> 00:20:08,624 He then went, "OK. Ask him whether I can come back in eight days." 273 00:20:08,708 --> 00:20:10,334 I didn't like his pushiness. 274 00:20:10,418 --> 00:20:13,295 I said, "He asked whether he can come back in eight days." 275 00:20:13,379 --> 00:20:17,258 El Chapo said, "First of all, he won't be coming back here by himself, my friend. 276 00:20:17,633 --> 00:20:20,261 If you don't come, there won't be an interview. 277 00:20:20,344 --> 00:20:22,179 Besides, who is going to translate?" 278 00:20:22,263 --> 00:20:26,350 So I told him, "Sean, you are not coming back by yourself. 279 00:20:26,434 --> 00:20:29,603 If I can come back with you in eight days, then yes." 280 00:20:30,229 --> 00:20:33,357 He asked me, "Can you?" And I... 281 00:20:34,900 --> 00:20:38,487 I said yes, because I felt cornered. 282 00:20:39,363 --> 00:20:41,741 But I didn't want to go back there. 283 00:20:41,824 --> 00:20:45,244 What we were doing there was already extremely dangerous. 284 00:20:48,205 --> 00:20:50,416 TV PRESENTER/ACTRESS 285 00:20:57,465 --> 00:21:01,260 For someone to come out of the blue like that, and... 286 00:21:01,343 --> 00:21:05,139 Mr. Guzm�n immediately said that he was not going to do it for safety reasons. 287 00:21:14,273 --> 00:21:15,858 And then Sean insisted again, 288 00:21:16,400 --> 00:21:19,445 "My friend, can we take a picture?" 289 00:21:20,237 --> 00:21:21,071 "What for?" 290 00:21:21,697 --> 00:21:23,407 "For Rolling Stone magazine. 291 00:21:23,491 --> 00:21:27,703 So that they know I was with you and I'm not making this up." 292 00:21:27,787 --> 00:21:30,539 And he said, "What do you think, my friend?" 293 00:21:30,623 --> 00:21:33,709 And I... "As you wish, my friend." 294 00:21:34,418 --> 00:21:35,503 "OK, let's do it." 295 00:21:36,212 --> 00:21:38,422 I thought, "I can't believe what I'm hearing. 296 00:21:38,506 --> 00:21:40,716 I can't believe what is happening right now." 297 00:21:42,968 --> 00:21:47,056 I think that the photo of Kate, El Chapo and Sean Penn 298 00:21:47,139 --> 00:21:50,392 is the result of that tense moment for Kate. 299 00:21:50,935 --> 00:21:53,813 If they tell you, "Shall we take a picture?" 300 00:21:54,647 --> 00:21:57,817 I'd like to see a single person capable of saying, 301 00:21:57,900 --> 00:22:00,027 "I won't be in a picture with you." 302 00:22:01,070 --> 00:22:02,071 I'd like to see that. 303 00:22:04,532 --> 00:22:06,492 We got back from taking the photos. 304 00:22:07,868 --> 00:22:12,039 And he told me, "My friend, I think it's time for you to go to bed." 305 00:22:12,790 --> 00:22:15,125 I said, "Yes, I think so, my friend." 306 00:22:15,209 --> 00:22:18,295 I stood up and he immediately came to get my chair. 307 00:22:18,921 --> 00:22:20,798 And he told me, "I'm coming with you." 308 00:22:21,799 --> 00:22:26,178 It was one of those seconds when all your life flashes before your eyes. 309 00:22:26,262 --> 00:22:28,097 I turned around and looked at Sean... 310 00:22:30,182 --> 00:22:33,018 looking for help, wondering what to do, what to say, 311 00:22:33,102 --> 00:22:35,020 and what would happen now. 312 00:22:35,729 --> 00:22:41,151 During those seconds, I truly thought the absolute worst. 313 00:22:41,610 --> 00:22:44,738 And there was nothing I could do. What else could I do? 314 00:22:44,822 --> 00:22:46,532 I turned around, 315 00:22:46,615 --> 00:22:49,535 I started walking and he joined me here. 316 00:22:49,618 --> 00:22:52,288 He took my arm, my elbow, 317 00:22:53,080 --> 00:22:54,456 and he led the way. 318 00:22:54,540 --> 00:22:55,791 We carried on walking. 319 00:22:58,711 --> 00:23:02,339 We got to the entrance of a room, and he told me... 320 00:23:04,216 --> 00:23:06,885 "This will be your room. This is where you will sleep." 321 00:23:07,344 --> 00:23:09,054 There was no one around to see us. 322 00:23:09,138 --> 00:23:11,473 He could have done whatever he wanted to me. 323 00:23:13,642 --> 00:23:16,687 Kate was in danger, at risk. 324 00:23:17,313 --> 00:23:18,564 At the end of the day, 325 00:23:18,647 --> 00:23:21,233 you are in a savage world, you are in the jungle. 326 00:23:21,942 --> 00:23:25,070 She was at his mercy. Kate knew this. 327 00:23:25,571 --> 00:23:30,576 He could have said, "Since I have Kate here, well, I'm going to cross the line. 328 00:23:30,659 --> 00:23:34,997 I'll touch her, kiss her, use her body..." 329 00:23:35,623 --> 00:23:42,171 I think Kate was more afraid that he might do something to her. 330 00:23:42,588 --> 00:23:46,342 He could have killed her or raped her. She was in his hands. 331 00:23:47,593 --> 00:23:50,012 To a great extent, 332 00:23:50,095 --> 00:23:56,977 the story of drug dealing and the part that characters like El Chapo play 333 00:23:57,061 --> 00:23:59,229 is understood through this nostalgic idea 334 00:23:59,313 --> 00:24:02,441 that in the past, drug lords were good people. 335 00:24:02,524 --> 00:24:03,901 That is not true. 336 00:24:04,234 --> 00:24:07,237 It is said that the ethical codes were broken, 337 00:24:07,780 --> 00:24:11,533 that there used to be ethical codes that prevented any assault on women, 338 00:24:11,617 --> 00:24:13,744 any attack on families, 339 00:24:13,827 --> 00:24:17,956 and through which anyone who was not in the business had to be respected. 340 00:24:18,791 --> 00:24:19,833 That's false. 341 00:24:19,917 --> 00:24:24,254 Women were a commodity, as Kate pointed out. 342 00:24:24,755 --> 00:24:28,467 Women were mostly used for pleasure, 343 00:24:28,550 --> 00:24:32,596 and narcos didn't bother marrying them, 344 00:24:32,680 --> 00:24:35,140 or they married one, but then had others. 345 00:24:35,224 --> 00:24:37,726 And if they didn't like them, they would rape them. 346 00:24:38,394 --> 00:24:40,729 The relationship El Chapo had 347 00:24:41,397 --> 00:24:43,899 while he was in Puente Grande... 348 00:24:43,982 --> 00:24:47,444 He had a girlfriend there - a penitentiary cook. 349 00:24:47,528 --> 00:24:49,863 The truth is he forced her to be with him, 350 00:24:49,947 --> 00:24:51,990 because, "You can't reject El Chapo." 351 00:24:52,074 --> 00:24:54,576 That's in line with what she said. 352 00:24:54,660 --> 00:24:56,245 This relationship he had 353 00:24:56,328 --> 00:24:59,248 in Puente Grande with Zulema, 354 00:24:59,331 --> 00:25:01,208 the love letters he wrote to her... 355 00:25:01,792 --> 00:25:03,877 They were very sappy. 356 00:25:03,961 --> 00:25:05,713 You wouldn't think 357 00:25:06,130 --> 00:25:10,217 that one of the most wanted criminals in the country could be so sappy 358 00:25:10,300 --> 00:25:13,220 in terms of his writing and his personality. 359 00:25:13,721 --> 00:25:16,640 Zulema Hern�ndez ended up being murdered. 360 00:25:16,724 --> 00:25:19,309 Apparently, it was the Los Zetas Cartel who did it. 361 00:25:21,103 --> 00:25:24,273 She was found in the trunk of a van. 362 00:25:24,356 --> 00:25:28,569 She was disfigured and had "Z" marks on her body. 363 00:25:34,908 --> 00:25:36,076 He then stared at me. 364 00:25:37,578 --> 00:25:38,662 And I thought... 365 00:25:40,789 --> 00:25:42,458 "Let's see what happens." 366 00:25:43,250 --> 00:25:46,295 I told him, "My friend, don't forget about the tweet. 367 00:25:46,712 --> 00:25:49,256 Don't forget what I told you in that tweet, 368 00:25:49,715 --> 00:25:51,425 and the reason why we are here. 369 00:25:53,218 --> 00:25:56,638 We have to do the right thing. Let's do something good. 370 00:25:56,722 --> 00:25:59,475 And I would like for part of the profits from this film 371 00:25:59,558 --> 00:26:03,145 to be donated to the families of those affected by organized crime." 372 00:26:04,188 --> 00:26:07,858 I don't know. I was very nervous. 373 00:26:07,941 --> 00:26:12,070 But I thought, "I have to say it. I'm here. This is my only chance. 374 00:26:12,154 --> 00:26:15,115 And there won't be another one, so I have to say it." 375 00:26:15,908 --> 00:26:17,284 He said, "My friend... 376 00:26:18,744 --> 00:26:19,953 I wasn't wrong about you. 377 00:26:20,037 --> 00:26:21,246 You have a big heart. 378 00:26:22,372 --> 00:26:23,415 Let's do that." 379 00:26:24,500 --> 00:26:25,793 He said, "I'm leaving now. 380 00:26:26,335 --> 00:26:31,423 I never stay where my guests are staying, for their safety and mine. 381 00:26:32,007 --> 00:26:34,593 So you won't see me again. This is goodbye. 382 00:26:35,219 --> 00:26:40,432 And thank you for giving me some of the best hours in a very long time." 383 00:26:41,016 --> 00:26:42,643 He hugged me again, 384 00:26:43,393 --> 00:26:44,853 and said, "I am leaving now." 385 00:26:48,440 --> 00:26:49,817 OCTOBER 3, 2015 386 00:26:49,900 --> 00:26:52,236 Before dawn, Kate and her companions 387 00:26:52,319 --> 00:26:55,155 set off on an eight-hour drive back to Guadalajara. 388 00:26:55,239 --> 00:26:59,326 Kate and Sean were scheduled to fly back to Los Angeles together. 389 00:27:02,371 --> 00:27:04,414 We were on our way back from the mountains, 390 00:27:05,040 --> 00:27:09,753 filled with adrenaline and emotions. 391 00:27:09,837 --> 00:27:12,256 We'd had an experience like no other. 392 00:27:12,339 --> 00:27:14,508 We were also very tired. 393 00:27:15,300 --> 00:27:18,345 I fell asleep and Sean hugged me, 394 00:27:18,428 --> 00:27:21,306 and he put my head on his shoulder. 395 00:27:21,723 --> 00:27:23,350 I think I touched his chest. 396 00:27:24,810 --> 00:27:26,603 Or something like that. He said... 397 00:27:26,687 --> 00:27:30,566 Later on he said, "That moment when you touched my chest, 398 00:27:30,649 --> 00:27:32,776 I knew something would happen between us." 399 00:27:54,423 --> 00:27:57,009 I told her, "Sean Penn? Really? 400 00:27:57,092 --> 00:27:58,093 That guy?" 401 00:27:58,969 --> 00:28:02,431 Of course, he can be fascinating, but not as a friend, 402 00:28:02,514 --> 00:28:04,975 and less so as the seducer he is. 403 00:28:05,058 --> 00:28:08,312 Because, like many other men, he obviously tried to seduce her. 404 00:28:08,854 --> 00:28:14,526 When we got back, we were very moved. A lot had happened. 405 00:28:14,610 --> 00:28:19,865 So I think it made sense for something to happen between us. 406 00:28:21,617 --> 00:28:26,788 The guy is, or so I thought, very sensitive to many causes. 407 00:28:26,872 --> 00:28:29,207 He would show me videos from Haiti, 408 00:28:29,291 --> 00:28:32,210 videos showing how he's helped the people there. 409 00:28:32,586 --> 00:28:35,255 And I saw him cry. We cried together. 410 00:28:35,339 --> 00:28:38,133 He knew how to say the things that I wanted to hear. 411 00:28:38,592 --> 00:28:40,761 He knew how to gain my trust. 412 00:28:41,428 --> 00:28:44,097 The relationship was the result of the circumstances. 413 00:28:44,181 --> 00:28:45,641 I enjoyed it and... 414 00:28:46,558 --> 00:28:48,143 I don't regret it. 415 00:28:50,103 --> 00:28:52,272 I fell, my friend. What can I say? 416 00:28:54,900 --> 00:28:56,735 OCTOBER 6, 2015 417 00:28:56,818 --> 00:29:02,032 FOUR DAYS AFTER THE MEETING WITH EL CHAPO. 418 00:29:05,202 --> 00:29:08,205 WELCOME TO BADIRAGUATO 419 00:29:10,666 --> 00:29:15,545 After Kate del Castillo and Sean Penn's visit to El Chapo Guzm�n, 420 00:29:15,963 --> 00:29:18,048 there was a capture attempt 421 00:29:18,507 --> 00:29:20,425 by the federal government. 422 00:29:20,884 --> 00:29:23,136 But he wasn't captured. 423 00:29:23,679 --> 00:29:26,223 Mr. Guzm�n's abilities are surprising. 424 00:29:26,306 --> 00:29:28,475 I mean, he just outsmarts the government. 425 00:29:29,393 --> 00:29:34,648 Few people have that kind of information and knowledge of the mountain range. 426 00:29:34,731 --> 00:29:37,859 He ran all of it. He's always been there. 427 00:29:37,943 --> 00:29:43,949 Of course he knew all the details and the places where he could hide. 428 00:29:44,616 --> 00:29:47,786 The National Security Commission confirmed that Guzm�n Loera 429 00:29:47,869 --> 00:29:50,789 narrowly avoided a recapture operation. 430 00:29:50,872 --> 00:29:54,042 It has now known that the injuries he suffered on his face and leg 431 00:29:54,126 --> 00:29:56,503 were the result of him rolling down a ravine 432 00:29:56,586 --> 00:29:58,672 in the municipality of Cosal�, Sinaloa. 433 00:29:59,965 --> 00:30:04,136 What I know is what El Chapo told me by text message. 434 00:30:05,053 --> 00:30:09,850 He told me that the military had got in and had killed a lot of people. 435 00:30:10,934 --> 00:30:15,105 I cannot confirm that because I looked all over the news and found nothing. 436 00:30:15,188 --> 00:30:18,692 Then something came up in a newspaper called El Debate. 437 00:30:21,361 --> 00:30:23,530 They showed a live video, 438 00:30:23,613 --> 00:30:27,242 and you could hear the shots being fired and the helicopters. 439 00:30:27,743 --> 00:30:28,827 They were running. 440 00:30:28,910 --> 00:30:31,705 They were running and saying, "They are killing people." 441 00:30:33,790 --> 00:30:37,461 LIVE RECORDING OF THE SINALOA RAID - EL DEBATE NEWSPAPER 442 00:30:37,544 --> 00:30:39,087 The soldiers are attacking us. 443 00:30:39,838 --> 00:30:41,381 I want them to leave. 444 00:30:42,049 --> 00:30:46,053 This recording is for all human rights organizations. 445 00:30:46,136 --> 00:30:48,055 I'm scared, Mom. 446 00:30:48,638 --> 00:30:50,098 Sons of bitches! 447 00:30:50,182 --> 00:30:51,266 Calm down, son. 448 00:30:51,350 --> 00:30:52,642 We're panicking. 449 00:30:53,268 --> 00:30:56,355 According to Sean, they came in because of us. 450 00:30:56,438 --> 00:30:58,106 They knew we were there. 451 00:30:59,316 --> 00:31:01,860 And they didn't want to go in while we were there 452 00:31:01,943 --> 00:31:07,324 to avoid any harm to us, to avoid killing us by mistake, for whatever reason, 453 00:31:07,407 --> 00:31:11,578 as if our lives were worth more than the lives of the people there. 454 00:31:12,079 --> 00:31:14,247 I was at home with the kids. 455 00:31:14,331 --> 00:31:18,668 We heard the helicopter but thought it was passing by, as it always does. 456 00:31:19,044 --> 00:31:22,255 Then it turned around and started shooting a rain of bullets. 457 00:31:23,006 --> 00:31:25,217 JOURNALIST 458 00:31:34,851 --> 00:31:36,269 During those days, 459 00:31:36,353 --> 00:31:40,649 we were certain that El Chapo's pursuit was a very strong one. 460 00:31:41,358 --> 00:31:43,693 There were no killings. There were violations. 461 00:31:43,777 --> 00:31:46,363 There were violations and people got really scared. 462 00:31:46,446 --> 00:31:48,615 They had to leave because the military came, 463 00:31:48,698 --> 00:31:51,618 but there were no search warrants or any of that legal stuff. 464 00:32:18,103 --> 00:32:20,772 I honestly don't know what really happened. 465 00:32:23,191 --> 00:32:25,485 It's one of those things that... 466 00:32:29,614 --> 00:32:34,161 hurts me, and it makes me feel really guilty, 467 00:32:34,244 --> 00:32:38,707 and it's one of the things that I regret. 468 00:32:39,124 --> 00:32:43,837 Maybe if we had not gone there, none of that would have happened. 469 00:32:44,796 --> 00:32:46,631 "What if" no longer exists. 470 00:32:47,674 --> 00:32:51,261 And that is now out of my hands, you know? 471 00:32:51,803 --> 00:32:53,680 Many things were out of my hands. 472 00:32:58,894 --> 00:33:00,562 OCTOBER 12, 2015 473 00:33:00,645 --> 00:33:04,649 TEN DAYS AFTER THE MEETING. 474 00:33:08,445 --> 00:33:11,198 Our sources told us, 475 00:33:11,656 --> 00:33:12,616 "You know what? 476 00:33:12,699 --> 00:33:15,702 El Chapo Guzm�n has just had a meeting with Kate del Castillo 477 00:33:16,286 --> 00:33:18,788 at the Sinaloa University reserve in Cosal�." 478 00:33:19,498 --> 00:33:22,250 This looks like the place where we met. 479 00:33:23,293 --> 00:33:25,128 It might actually be this place. 480 00:33:26,129 --> 00:33:29,883 I honestly don't remember much because it was all very dark. 481 00:33:30,383 --> 00:33:34,846 We explored the reserve with the help of the people who work there. 482 00:33:34,930 --> 00:33:39,893 We took pictures of the interior and exterior of the cabins. 483 00:33:40,352 --> 00:33:45,315 And I was able to determine that Kate del Castillo and El Chapo Guzm�n 484 00:33:45,398 --> 00:33:48,151 had indeed met at the University's ecological reserve. 485 00:33:49,778 --> 00:33:52,781 The room where Kate del Castillo stayed 486 00:33:52,864 --> 00:33:54,616 was called "Hummingbird." 487 00:33:58,620 --> 00:34:00,205 I do remember that my room... 488 00:34:00,705 --> 00:34:05,043 Well, the room I slept in with Sean and the other two producers 489 00:34:05,126 --> 00:34:07,295 looked like this and was divided by a screen. 490 00:34:07,379 --> 00:34:09,005 This might be the place. 491 00:34:10,340 --> 00:34:15,428 I got her home phone number through a contact in Mexico City. 492 00:34:18,515 --> 00:34:20,308 When she answered the call, I said, 493 00:34:20,392 --> 00:34:24,604 "Hi, I'm Ismael Bojorquez, the editor of the R�odoce newspaper, and so on..." 494 00:34:24,688 --> 00:34:26,398 "I WAS NEVER IN SINALOA," KATE SAYS 495 00:34:26,481 --> 00:34:29,568 "I just wanted to know whether you were in Sinaloa recently. 496 00:34:29,651 --> 00:34:31,403 As far as we know, you were." 497 00:34:32,529 --> 00:34:35,407 "Sinaloa? I've never been to Sinaloa." 498 00:34:35,991 --> 00:34:37,826 "Were you not at the Cosal�Reserve?" 499 00:34:37,909 --> 00:34:38,994 "Not at all." 500 00:34:39,494 --> 00:34:41,454 "We have sources that tell us you were." 501 00:34:41,538 --> 00:34:43,582 "I don't even know where Cosal�is." 502 00:34:44,374 --> 00:34:46,251 "Listen, how did you get this number?" 503 00:34:46,334 --> 00:34:47,711 "I got it in Mexico City." 504 00:34:48,211 --> 00:34:51,881 "Firstly, I don't like you calling here. Secondly, I don't know who you are. 505 00:34:51,965 --> 00:34:54,843 And thirdly, I'm fed up with all of that nonsense..." 506 00:34:55,302 --> 00:34:58,054 "...you are trying to make up." 507 00:34:59,222 --> 00:35:03,518 Yes, I remember that conversation. But I was never told who they were. 508 00:35:03,602 --> 00:35:08,064 Where he was... I don't remember him telling me he was a journalist. 509 00:35:08,148 --> 00:35:10,859 I do remember this call and my blood pressure dropping. 510 00:35:10,942 --> 00:35:11,985 MEETING AT THE UAS 511 00:35:12,068 --> 00:35:13,445 It truly ripped me apart, 512 00:35:13,528 --> 00:35:17,282 because I thought, "They already know. They know it was us. 513 00:35:17,741 --> 00:35:19,326 It will all be revealed." 514 00:35:19,951 --> 00:35:22,120 I felt completely helpless. 515 00:35:23,079 --> 00:35:26,416 I obviously told Sean and everyone else that they called to say that. 516 00:35:26,499 --> 00:35:29,836 But it was really strange because they mispronounced "Cosal�." 517 00:35:29,919 --> 00:35:31,129 They removed the accent. 518 00:35:31,212 --> 00:35:34,257 I thought it might be a guy from the DEA, 519 00:35:34,799 --> 00:35:37,927 one of those gringos that cannot pronounce words properly. 520 00:35:38,011 --> 00:35:41,556 Because a local would know it's "Cosal�" and not "Cosala." 521 00:35:43,350 --> 00:35:45,435 I didn't even know what to say. 522 00:35:45,518 --> 00:35:47,437 But I do remember his call. 523 00:35:52,609 --> 00:35:57,238 IN THE FOLLOWING WEEKS 524 00:36:09,793 --> 00:36:12,253 She is a woman that takes risks. 525 00:36:12,712 --> 00:36:15,298 The first risk I know of 526 00:36:15,382 --> 00:36:19,344 was her decision to come to the most difficult place to break into: 527 00:36:19,427 --> 00:36:20,261 Los Angeles. 528 00:36:21,179 --> 00:36:23,139 And she succeeded. 529 00:36:23,223 --> 00:36:25,058 But maybe that wasn't enough, 530 00:36:25,141 --> 00:36:27,018 so she went looking for... 531 00:36:27,519 --> 00:36:28,478 El Chapo. 532 00:36:29,270 --> 00:36:31,106 And she took a great risk, 533 00:36:31,189 --> 00:36:35,568 because he's involved in drug dealing, crime, murders... 534 00:36:35,652 --> 00:36:38,822 But he is a mythical character. 535 00:36:39,572 --> 00:36:43,910 If anyone in our industry 536 00:36:44,577 --> 00:36:46,955 had been offered an interview with El Chapo, 537 00:36:47,038 --> 00:36:48,832 they would have gone. 538 00:36:49,582 --> 00:36:50,792 I would have gone. 539 00:37:21,614 --> 00:37:25,577 The possibility of coming into contact with someone like that, 540 00:37:26,786 --> 00:37:30,874 which does not mean endorsing his actions, 541 00:37:30,957 --> 00:37:33,626 but finding out his motives and telling his story... 542 00:37:35,920 --> 00:37:38,298 That would tempt anyone. 543 00:37:38,590 --> 00:37:40,300 Because you have to tell the story, 544 00:37:40,383 --> 00:37:44,387 and the story gets told by going where the action happens, 545 00:37:44,471 --> 00:37:46,306 not by sitting behind a desk. 546 00:38:01,362 --> 00:38:04,073 We had signed the movie rights, 547 00:38:04,157 --> 00:38:09,287 but the plans for a movie about El Chapo were put on hold. 548 00:38:11,372 --> 00:38:14,584 After we met with El Chapo in October, 549 00:38:14,667 --> 00:38:17,837 I devoted myself to Sean's article. 550 00:38:19,964 --> 00:38:25,804 I was still being loyal to Rolling Stone and to Sean. 551 00:38:27,764 --> 00:38:30,975 I couldn't say anything to anyone because it was a delicate issue. 552 00:38:31,059 --> 00:38:33,853 It was not something I could tell everyone about. 553 00:38:34,771 --> 00:38:38,441 I was the intermediary between Sean Penn and El Chapo Guzm�n. 554 00:38:38,525 --> 00:38:42,904 And, well, it wasn't easy because he was a fugitive at the time. 555 00:38:44,948 --> 00:38:50,912 I was constantly afraid that he might call me 556 00:38:50,995 --> 00:38:52,413 or that Sean might call me. 557 00:38:52,497 --> 00:38:55,458 We had disposable phones. 558 00:38:55,917 --> 00:38:58,419 I always had them on, next to my bed. 559 00:38:59,462 --> 00:39:02,590 It was horrible. The tension was just awful. 560 00:39:04,300 --> 00:39:08,096 And you're also physically and mentally exhausted because you don't sleep. 561 00:39:08,680 --> 00:39:10,932 I was scared all night. 562 00:39:14,644 --> 00:39:17,730 I couldn't lean on anyone, so I found support in Sean. 563 00:39:17,814 --> 00:39:19,566 My support at that time was Sean. 564 00:39:20,775 --> 00:39:23,403 We were both going through the same. 565 00:39:25,780 --> 00:39:27,407 I know I was never alone, 566 00:39:28,199 --> 00:39:31,452 but in those moments, I felt alone. 567 00:39:55,810 --> 00:39:57,770 NOVEMBER 20, 2015 568 00:39:57,854 --> 00:39:59,272 Six weeks after the meeting. 569 00:39:59,355 --> 00:40:01,357 Unable to visit El Chapo in Mexico again, 570 00:40:01,441 --> 00:40:03,943 Kate and Sean decide to send him video instructions 571 00:40:04,027 --> 00:40:05,612 to record the interview. 572 00:40:07,864 --> 00:40:12,493 We went to the Beverly Hills hotel to record a video. 573 00:40:12,577 --> 00:40:14,913 That's where Sulich�n and Ib��ez were staying. 574 00:40:14,996 --> 00:40:17,707 So we got together there once, with Sean, 575 00:40:17,790 --> 00:40:21,628 to tell them that we needed a video, and ask whether they could send it to us, 576 00:40:21,711 --> 00:40:23,796 even if it was just five seconds long, 577 00:40:23,880 --> 00:40:26,049 to prove it was him answering the questions. 578 00:40:26,132 --> 00:40:29,260 Rolling Stone was asking for it as a fact checker, 579 00:40:29,344 --> 00:40:33,264 to legitimate this, and to make sure we... 580 00:40:33,348 --> 00:40:35,975 I said, "You already have the photo for that, I mean... 581 00:40:37,060 --> 00:40:38,811 The photo works just fine." 582 00:40:38,895 --> 00:40:40,939 "No, we want a video." So that was it. 583 00:40:41,898 --> 00:40:45,985 My friend, I am here with Sean, and we'd like to tell you something. 584 00:40:46,778 --> 00:40:47,987 Hello, my friend. 585 00:40:56,829 --> 00:41:00,208 We are trying... I will translate now. 586 00:41:00,291 --> 00:41:05,672 We are trying to send you a video explaining how you have to do it. 587 00:41:06,422 --> 00:41:09,008 I put all of that on a USB stick. 588 00:41:10,468 --> 00:41:15,181 The next time I went to Mexico was to attend the F�nix Awards. 589 00:41:15,264 --> 00:41:19,060 We've followed Kate since we first saw her in Los Angeles and then Marbella. 590 00:41:19,143 --> 00:41:21,562 Now, we're in her home country. How are you, Kate? 591 00:41:21,646 --> 00:41:23,982 Welcome to my country. Welcome to Mexico. 592 00:41:24,065 --> 00:41:27,902 One of the lawyers left me a message 593 00:41:28,361 --> 00:41:30,822 at my hotel, under a different name, 594 00:41:30,905 --> 00:41:33,908 to tell me where and at what time he would meet me, 595 00:41:34,534 --> 00:41:35,868 so I could give him the USB. 596 00:41:35,952 --> 00:41:41,374 The message said, "See you in Xochimilco, at a certain entrance and a certain time." 597 00:41:42,000 --> 00:41:44,168 And I was like, "Fuck! Xochimilco..." 598 00:41:46,129 --> 00:41:47,755 NOVEMBER 24, 2015 599 00:41:47,839 --> 00:41:51,175 XOCHIMILCO MEXICO CITY 600 00:41:51,926 --> 00:41:55,847 So we got to Xochimilco, and there was no light whatsoever. 601 00:41:55,930 --> 00:41:57,640 TRADITIONAL PIER - XOCHIMILCO 602 00:41:57,724 --> 00:42:00,101 She arrived late, at around 2:30 a.m. 603 00:42:00,184 --> 00:42:03,104 We chose that place so we could go unnoticed. 604 00:42:03,187 --> 00:42:05,857 At any other place, it would have been easy to spot us. 605 00:42:07,900 --> 00:42:11,571 I saw some cars parked, and then suddenly one turned its lights on. 606 00:42:12,905 --> 00:42:15,283 I saw four people getting out. 607 00:42:16,534 --> 00:42:17,744 They said, "Come here." 608 00:42:19,203 --> 00:42:24,167 I thought I would simply get there, give them the USB stick and leave. 609 00:42:25,418 --> 00:42:28,171 Then they asked me to get in a canoe, 610 00:42:28,254 --> 00:42:31,132 and I did because I felt I couldn't really say no. 611 00:42:31,215 --> 00:42:32,759 I was trapped. 612 00:42:33,718 --> 00:42:35,762 I got in the canoe and we left. 613 00:42:38,473 --> 00:42:40,933 I felt very scared at that point because I thought, 614 00:42:41,017 --> 00:42:44,896 I know the lawyer, but I don't know any of these three people. 615 00:42:45,772 --> 00:42:47,023 I don't know who they are. 616 00:42:49,108 --> 00:42:50,693 So we sailed through the canals. 617 00:42:50,777 --> 00:42:53,071 If anyone knows Xochimilco, this is... 618 00:42:53,154 --> 00:42:55,281 We call it "Mexico's Venice." 619 00:42:57,158 --> 00:43:01,204 It was the dead of night, and there was absolutely no light anywhere. 620 00:43:02,205 --> 00:43:05,208 This meeting was simply for me to give them the USB stick. 621 00:43:06,375 --> 00:43:08,920 The only thing I wanted was to go back quickly, 622 00:43:09,003 --> 00:43:12,090 or if anything were to happen, for it to happen quickly. 623 00:43:14,884 --> 00:43:18,346 I told them, "I think it's time to go back. 624 00:43:18,429 --> 00:43:21,474 I'm very tired and I have to work tomorrow, and... 625 00:43:22,391 --> 00:43:24,393 Please, let's just go back." 626 00:43:27,021 --> 00:43:28,106 They said, "OK... 627 00:43:28,856 --> 00:43:30,274 Turn around!" 628 00:43:31,818 --> 00:43:36,280 And that was it. We went back. But we had been out for two hours. 629 00:43:38,241 --> 00:43:40,993 And just as I'm stepping out of the canoe, 630 00:43:41,577 --> 00:43:44,247 the guy that was rowing recognized me. 631 00:43:45,915 --> 00:43:48,668 "Oh! I didn't realize it was you!" 632 00:43:48,751 --> 00:43:52,880 So, selfie time. With the canoe guy. And the other three. 633 00:43:53,631 --> 00:43:55,758 I didn't want those selfies to be published 634 00:43:55,842 --> 00:43:59,095 and for people to think that I was partying with those guys. 635 00:44:06,602 --> 00:44:08,312 I ended up getting back to the hotel 636 00:44:09,063 --> 00:44:12,150 at around 4:00- 4:30 in the morning. 637 00:44:12,817 --> 00:44:14,068 I closed the door, 638 00:44:14,485 --> 00:44:18,114 and I started crying and crying and crying 639 00:44:18,197 --> 00:44:22,160 like a baby, like I hadn't in a very long time. 640 00:44:22,243 --> 00:44:24,078 I started wailing. It was horrible. 641 00:44:25,037 --> 00:44:29,167 I was also kicking myself a bit. "Why do I get involved in situations like this? 642 00:44:29,250 --> 00:44:31,043 Why do I risk my life like that?" 643 00:44:31,919 --> 00:44:34,005 I didn't feel safe at all there. 644 00:44:34,088 --> 00:44:38,718 I was... alone with four people... 645 00:44:39,135 --> 00:44:40,720 And I only knew one. 646 00:44:41,429 --> 00:44:44,015 That experience was far worse... 647 00:44:45,183 --> 00:44:48,769 than going to Sinaloa to meet El Chapo. 648 00:44:52,023 --> 00:44:53,816 DECEMBER 5, 2015 649 00:44:53,900 --> 00:44:58,571 The next mission was to get the video that we had asked El Chapo to film. 650 00:44:59,113 --> 00:45:02,283 Sean was right here, breathing on my neck all the time, 651 00:45:02,366 --> 00:45:04,201 putting more and more pressure on me. 652 00:45:04,285 --> 00:45:07,747 At the same time, I was also putting pressure on Mr. Guzm�n. 653 00:45:08,748 --> 00:45:11,834 I asked him, "How are you getting on with the video, my friend? 654 00:45:11,918 --> 00:45:14,211 Did you film it? Did you answer the questions?" 655 00:45:15,463 --> 00:45:17,423 In the end, he told me, 656 00:45:18,299 --> 00:45:19,425 "The video is ready." 657 00:45:20,843 --> 00:45:23,638 It turned out that someone was going to travel to New York, 658 00:45:23,721 --> 00:45:27,642 and I asked that person a favor. "Listen, I'm being sent a couple of things. 659 00:45:27,725 --> 00:45:32,021 I'm not sure what, but please bring it to me, and I'll meet you in New York." 660 00:45:32,104 --> 00:45:33,105 "Yes, of course." 661 00:45:33,189 --> 00:45:34,023 And that was it. 662 00:45:35,358 --> 00:45:37,526 It was a phone, literally. 663 00:45:38,361 --> 00:45:40,780 I turned it on and started looking for something, 664 00:45:40,863 --> 00:45:44,200 and I suddenly saw a video with his face on it. 665 00:45:45,201 --> 00:45:47,328 I saw El Chapo Guzm�n's face. 666 00:45:48,704 --> 00:45:53,334 He was wearing a blue shirt, sitting on a chair like this, and looking very relaxed. 667 00:45:53,709 --> 00:45:56,837 He was looking straight ahead, speaking to the camera. 668 00:45:59,090 --> 00:46:03,803 I was taken aback by the demystification that was achieved through that video. 669 00:46:05,054 --> 00:46:07,598 It gave a voice and a face 670 00:46:08,099 --> 00:46:09,058 to the myth. 671 00:46:10,309 --> 00:46:13,312 If he cared about his anonymity... 672 00:46:14,647 --> 00:46:16,273 that was the biggest mistake. 673 00:46:17,066 --> 00:46:21,362 I want it to be clear that the content of this interview... 674 00:46:22,989 --> 00:46:27,535 is exclusively for Miss Kate del Castillo 675 00:46:28,577 --> 00:46:30,579 and Mr. Sean Penn. 676 00:46:31,455 --> 00:46:33,874 Subtitle translation by Laura Cucurullo